Messages from spirit world

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David and King Saul, by Rembrandt

The king of Israel, Saul, had left God, and not being able anymore to receive God's direct guidance, neither directly nor through prophets of God, he turned for information to mediums. 1 Samuel 27-3/19 (Revised Std Ver):

"Now Samuel had died, and all Israel had mourned for him and buried him in Ramah, his own city. And Saul had put the mediums and the wizards out of the land. ⁴ The Philistines assembled, and came and encamped at Shunem; and Saul gathered all Israel, and they encamped at Gilbo'a. ⁵ When Saul saw the army of the Philistines, he was afraid, and his heart trembled greatly. ⁶ And when Saul inquired of the LORD, the LORD did not answer him, either by dreams, or by Urim, or by prophets. ⁷ Then Saul said to his servants, "Seek out for me a woman who is a medium, that I may go to her and inquire of her." And his servants said to him, "Behold, there is a medium at Endor." ⁸ So Saul disguised himself and put on other garments, and went, he and two men with him; and they came to the woman by night. And he said, "Divine for me by a spirit, and bring up for me whomever I shall name to you." ⁹ The woman said to him, "Surely you know what Saul has done, how he has cut off the mediums and the wizards from the land. Why then are you laying a snare for my life to bring about my death?" ¹⁰ But Saul swore to her by the LORD, "As the LORD lives, no punishment shall come upon you for this thing." ¹¹ Then the woman said, "Whom shall I bring up for you?" He said, "Bring up Samuel for me." ¹² When the woman saw Samuel, she cried out with a loud voice; and the woman said to Saul, "Why have you deceived me? You are Saul." ¹³ The king said to her, "Have no fear; what do you see?" And the woman said to Saul, "I see a god coming up out of the earth." ¹⁴ He said to her, "What is his appearance?" And she said, "An old man is coming up; and he is wrapped in a robe." And Saul knew that it was Samuel, and he bowed with his face to the ground, and did obeisance. ¹⁵ Then Samuel said to Saul, "Why have you disturbed me by bringing me up?" Saul answered, "I am in great distress; for the Philistines are warring against me, and God has turned away from me and answers me no more, either by prophets or by dreams; therefore I have summoned you to tell me what I shall do." ¹⁶ And Samuel said, "Why then do you ask me, since the LORD has turned from you and become your enemy? ¹⁷ The LORD has done to you as he spoke by me; for the LORD has torn the kingdom out of your hand, and given it to your neighbor, David. ¹⁸ Because you did not obey the voice of the LORD, and did not carry out his fierce wrath against Am'alek, therefore the LORD has done this thing to you this day. ¹⁹ Moreover the LORD will give Israel also with you into the hand of the Philistines; and tomorrow you and your sons shall be with me; the LORD will give the army of Israel also into the hand of the Philistines." "

I had to think of this biblical story when i came across a hugely weird site called 'Messages from spirit world.' On this site which apparently was set up by Derk van Dorsten (see this article), we find a long list of so-called revelations from the spiritual world all testifying of the greatness of Rev. Sun Myung Moon. While reading through all these purported reports from the spiritual world, i am trying to understand what could have been the intention of those in the spiritual world who fabricated these messages and of those who received and reported on them. It seems to me that if anyone wished to do great harm to Rev. Moon, this would be the most brilliant and effective way to do it.

Because, who could ever believe that most of the founders of world religions, together with communist dictators and mass murderers, and the originator of evil, Lucifer himself, and even 'God,' would all unitedly proclaim the greatness of Sun Myung Moon? Apparently all these spiritual beings have now been united under the banner of love of Rev. Moon and this came across by them only having received lectures on Rev. Moon's teaching.

Who could be so foolish to believe that all these people would suddenly 'know' the truth, that their hearts became soft and open, that they all decided to either recognize Sun Myung Moon as the greatest who ever lived, or would have repented for sins that are so terrible that if there were listed the crimes of the evil people included it would read like the worst horror book that has ever been written in human history.

These messages, the content conveyed through them, the emphasis put upon them on the website, these all occur to me as a ploy to bring Sun Myung Moon to fall, to make him look entirely ridiculous in the eyes of any logical thinking person. I don't know if Rev. Moon has recognized all of these messages, but if he would have done, it seems to me that this would have been his final and complete fall away from God.

Reading through the messages, one theme controls all of them. All of these messages could be summarized in one slogan: "Rev. Moon is the greatest, Rev. Moon is the greatest, Rev. Moon is the greatest." Could Sun Myung Moon really have approved these messages? It is entirely staggering and confusing.

I wonder what Jesus, Moses, Buddha and many other great saints of human history would have to say knowing that their names were used to exalt the glory of Sun Myung Moon, that their names were given in one line with those of the worst criminals of history, Lucifer, Mao Tse Tung, Pol Pot, Stalin, to mention just a few.

How could anybody be so foolish to believe that Satan himself and all these other criminals would have gone on their knees in repentance only after having heard some lectures about Rev. Moon and his Divine Principle? As if the act of only listening to explanations of truth or thought-to-be truth have ever been sufficient to bring anybody to repentance!

More information about the messages

• They are said to have been brought from spirit world through the medium Young Soon Kim
  

• In spirit world said to be moderated by Dr. Sang Hun Lee; quote from this Wikipedia article:

  "Sang Hun Lee (September 5, 1914 - March 22, 1999), was the author of several books on "Unification Thought". After his death, the Unification Church asserts that he conducted a number of seminars in the spirit world, from which testimony from deceased United States Presidents endorsing Sun Myung Moon were relayed."

• Dates of the messages: 1999-2001. Apparently there were some older messages dated 1997 which came moderated by or from Sang Hun Lee in spirit world. Not sure how this could be as Sang Hun Lee died only in 1999?
  

The alleged spirits who testified of Moon

• Lucifer
• St. Augustine
• Confucius
• Jesus, Buddha, Mohammed, Socrates
• The 12 disciples of Jesus
• Central figures of the Old-Testament age such as Abraham, Moses, David, Solomon, Elijah and many more
• Representatives of Christianity such as Paul, Marten Luther, John Wesley, Tertullian, the emperor Constantine and many more
• Church representatives denominational - such as Henry VIII, Ignatius Loyola, George Fox and many more
• Disciples of Confucius
• Communist thinkers Marx and Lenin
• Communist politicians - Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Honecker and many more
• Communist disciples - Ceaucescu, Ho Chi-Minh, Pol Pot and other mass murderers
• 120 world-famous communists - including the communists mentioned above
• 12 journalists - representing 120 world journalists
• A cloud of witnesses - including founders of world religions, communist central figures, and last but not least: 'GOD'
• 'God's' message to the UN & testimonies of 36 US presidents
  

Contact to spirit world

• See this video of an interview of Sun Myung Moon by Al Capp in 1972, where Moon states that he has the ability to relate to spirit world since his earliest childhood.
  

See also

• John Gorenfeld - The king of America (website and video) - http://www.gorenfeld.net/book/
  

Video: A new tomorrow, the early days of the UK Unification movement

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When i see these images filmed in the early days of the Unification movement in the United Kingdom, i cannot escape to make a comparison between the movement today and in that time. And with all respect, the early time comes out better.

There is a lot of conviction, some might say arrogance, in the narrative that goes with the film. There is spoken of

the most beautiful farmhouse of the UK, not physically but spiritually ..... because here God's Kingdom is built....

There is shown the printing of booklets containing 'God's Word.' Then we see images of a campaign of a group of Unification Church members going out in a doubledecker bus, to do 'God's work.'

Yet it is undeniable that the people shown in the film are happy and energetic. There is shown work on a farm, a tractor plowing the land, Rev. Moon planting a tree. This looks quite different from the large-scale peace conferences with celebrities from around the world.

Also Rev. Moon and his wife look like people you can love, unlike how they appear to me today. There are scenes of joyful singing and Rev. Moon giving a speech translated by Bo Hi Pak, one of Moon's elder disciples. Also Young Whi Kim, one of the first three disciples of Sun Myung Moon is shown for a short moment. Moon's voice in that time still sounded attractive.

At the end of the video you see members taking off in a chartered airplane to America, to restore that nation.

That's my impression of the videos, now see for yourself.








Here are the links to the videos on YouTube:

• Video 1

• Video 2

• Video 3

And here is the text as posted with the videos on YouTube:

This film, provides a great insight into the early years of the Unification Movement in the UK with footage of Reverend Moon making a holy ground in the village of Stanton FItzwarren. You can catch the enthusiasm and the spirit of dedication that the pioneers of the British movement had, and how creative they were in carrying out what they saw as their mission.

As always it also provides a helpful perspective on the present day when we are able to look back more than 30 years ago and see how everything was. As people's voices and cars have changed over the last 3 decades, so has the Unification Church.

How we live today is obviously so different, and it is a sign of how fast the world is always changing. All the more reason to always dig deep inside our heart to remember our identity and have a sense of where we come from.

Note: the sound in the latter part of the second video was missing when i watched it.